November 12, 2019 at 7:59 pm #24281
A few random thoughts about a potential civil war. It dawned on me that we preppers often talk about the possibility of civil war(left vs right) or a new revolution, but I really wonder what it would entail.
1) What do you think it would take for people to actually rise up in arms? I know that firearms confiscation would certainly result in various individuals resisting, but what would it take to organize militias? What level of mass spying? What level of taxation? What would it take for states (or counties or various parts of states) to secede?
2) What is your balloon going up sign that says “time to start resisting on a personal level” and what is the sign that you need to form an armed group? (Feel free to ignore this question for sake of not giving away too much info on a message board)
3) Even giving the generous assumption that 75% of the military stays with the tyrannical govt (and obviously some state governments as well), what sort of asymmetric actions do you think the conflict would involve? Disrupting supplies, small arms fire preventing aircraft from taking off?
Just pondering some possibilities, I’d love to hear your thoughts.
November 12, 2019 at 8:16 pm #24283
Not really sure how to answer those questions. Though I feel that the younger generation, say from 18 to maybe 40 years olds. boys are to busy wanting to be little girls instead of the sex they were born, as is the same about girls. Also the generation of we owe them everything. Why should they work for a living to support a family when they can get handouts for free. Then they can keep their drugs coming. Who will be the ones fighting in a civil war. The gays and lesbians, the freeloaders? What about the illegals? Don’t think they will be fighting our battles. Frankly, I think I am tired of the news, the elections, and God is in charge so I am just sitting back and watching the show. My concern is Russia sending over the missile that will put us in the dark ages as well as a collaspe of this country. One or the other if not both is going to happen as fortold in the Bible.
November 13, 2019 at 5:53 am #24290
I dont see Russia doing anything . They dont have to , we are doing it to ourselves . Much like when they collapsed .
November 13, 2019 at 11:00 am #24297
I think it could be a couple of things that might cause a real rise up so to speak.
Firearm confiscation is one.
All this talk about redistribution of wealth. Sounds all well and good when it is the 1%. But we have seen in recent bills introduced to apply a surcharge/tax on those making $1-2 million. How long is it before it is anyone making $150k? $100k? $75k? All to pay for someone else’s college education? Someone else’s healthcare? Subsidize someone else’s house payment?
Socioeconomic collapse, especially if any or even a few of the farming/agriculture issues we have seen recently and the worst comes to pass. Shortage of food, and people will get down right nutz. And they will follow anyone who promises them a quick, easy solution.
Mass surveillance: We do that to ourselves. What Google, Facebook, et al. have accomplished is the envy of governments and intelligence agencies around the world.
I do not discount some of these young radicals we have been seeing. I just posted an article about a Northwestern Dean’s reaction to a group of protesters who were attacking the school’s student journalists for covering the protests. Read the article and watch the video for yourself. This is not the first time I have heard the phrase “We are fighting for our lives!” Not only in this instance, but the other instances, I did not see anyone lose their life. But fact is they truly believe it. And nothing more dangerous than a true believer. To a degree we have seen the lengths they will go into in violence, disregard for property, or laws. And in this day and age of Trump, they are more than I would of thought. Even if there are those who cannot participate in a protest/demonstration, they could provide passive support.
What would it take them to go for full on violence? I dunno. But do not discount them out of hand.
Military stance in all of this? Who knows. Saw a poll that said the majority of officers were against Trump. That same poll said the majority of enlisted were for Trump. I think the military would have to sit that one out and keep an eye out for anyone (Russia, China etc) who tries to take advantage of the situation.
I agree with Tolik. The division in America is mostly by our own doing. When I say our own, I mean our own political process, corporate MSM, and even the American public has a degree of responsibility in this mess.
November 13, 2019 at 1:55 pm #24302
Benifit running out or not being “enough”
Any major grid disruption.
Who says it’s not part of plan…. lock up city cut off food and water 14 days later 80 percentt less people.those left grateful for a meal and shower will be your slave.
Who are the useless ones expecially since aI and bots are better than you? What value do you bring to the 1 percent that own everything hence your owners. In past best weapon 9f mass death with least repercussions is starvation ask the Germans, russian, chinese ect work far better than bullets and who in city could grow anything close to enough? It also stops resistance as no place to gather materials if starving mob burns and loots not much left of value.
November 28, 2019 at 12:51 pm #24546
Don’t need to imagine too much, plenty of current examples (Fance, HK, Venezuela…etc.) All political/.gov based sparks that morph into something else from where it started. Tuning into fight for various freedoms, real or perceived, seem to be the common theme.
Right now the US has plenty of politicians at all levels, on all sides willing to throw fuel on X fire by design or otherwise. Just a matter of time now, point of no return isn’t even in the rear view anymore.
Currently if .gov gets earnest about clamping down on anything 2A, rest assured .gov PTB will know what’s to follow and have a plan(s)….not good for the commoner. Will probably start with admin/bureaucratic repercussions, EG; want health care, tax benefit, food, whatever X benefit then turn in/register you arms. MSM only too happy to help and plebes willingly fall in line. Then…the mouth of truth,,,neighbor against neighbor. Door to door is highly unlikely.
Guaranteed some .gov muckity mucks have played out a “siege” addressed by Namelus. Add in natural disaster, wrestles natives, broad definition of “terrorist”, national security, etc. as a catalyst and there’s the easy button under the guise of “I’m with .gov and here to HELP”.
November 28, 2019 at 3:25 pm #24547
Three things about that .
- ” All plans turn to crap at first contact with the enemy “
- Humans could screw up a free lunch .
November 28, 2019 at 4:03 pm #24548
While the media might portray this generation as Marxists, there are plenty of young people who have been homeschooled or who otherwise identify with their conservative parents. Those who identify as Marxists are ill-prepared for actual resistance. Sticks and stones… Socioeconomic collapse would rile some. Firearm confiscation would rile most. While we didn’t homeschool all the way through, we did think that abolishment of homeschooling was cue. It’s imperative that we are able to have our own thoughts. You’d be surprised how many young people would resist.
November 28, 2019 at 4:55 pm #24550
Well remember stalingrad…. they supplied 1 gun and 5 clips for 5 people and where told you turn back we shoot you. They rounded up regular citizens and marched them into machine gun kill zones till they took a position. Not fighting was not option unless you wanted to die.
November 29, 2019 at 10:16 am #24567
Good to see ya again.
I agree with your first paragraph.
The second, I dunno. As long as BAU continues they maintain a degree of control and power. Once bullets start to fly, it is a crap shoot. Or, as Tolik mentioned, to paraphrase, Plans are only good till first contact. Then it is who can identify opportunities and exploit them faster, adjust to a fluid battlefield environment, and who has the logistics to supply is the one who is going to win.
I still see it as a more Balkanization kind of fall out IF things were to go sideways.
November 29, 2019 at 12:54 pm #24572
Thanks CB. Likewise.
Agreed on all points.
This is just how we get there and there’s plenty of “talent” to go around on all sides. Balkanization, I believe, is inevitable here in the US after the the Rubicon is crossed, just as all armed conflicts seem to go in part at the very least. After first contact and when it’s generally recognized as such, all bets are off except it will suck.
November 29, 2019 at 2:25 pm #24574
I still see the logistics part as being one of the bigger problems for either side.
Per Clinton, the “deplorables” many live in the flyover states, where a lot of our domestic food production comes from.
CA does not have a lot of in-state POL refineries. For that matter they also get a lot of their electricity and water from outside of the state. That could be a long way to secure those resources.
Flip side, CA has a sizeable population, could outnumber the lesser populace rural America. But are they willing to travel hundreds or thousands of miles to fight to get the power back on?
As we saw in the Battle of the Bulge, the Germans raced to secure key bridges, only to have the Americans blow them before the Germans could cross.
I dunno. I can see it going either way.
Regardless, as you state, it would suck all the way around.
Funny, Daisy just had a guest poster writing about “Embracing the Suck.”
November 29, 2019 at 2:56 pm #24576
Another aspect about the 4GW issue . As a government in crisis , one has to be very careful not to clamp down too hard on the civil population . LE is very ignorant of this . If they clamp down too hard , attempting to get rebs under control , they create more rebs , and sympathy toward them in the general population . Every action taken by the individual soldier , LE , etc , has the possibility of turning a person against them , a person that under other situations , would not get involved . At that point , it starts to get rapidly unmanageable , and unwinnable for them to try to stay in control , or in power . Our country is not like other countries , we are our own animal , and on the individual basis , even leftists like their freedoms , and will take offense to being abused . The evil snow ball , starts rolling .
November 29, 2019 at 3:03 pm #24578
HA, as an aside: I always thought that was a ridiculous saying especially how it grew into a droning mantra in .mil/MIC/.gov, To me it implies you’ve got no other choices and/or too soft to make them. Bunch of BS mostly from TPTB to spoon feed the mouth breathers an easy out, but obviously has stood the test of time. Tells you a lot right there.
I’ve seen particularly nasty demises from embracing the suck. While choices may be difficult and/or limited …STFU or GTFO.
- This reply was modified 1 week, 1 day ago by DB.
November 29, 2019 at 3:20 pm #24581
You hit it on the head, US isn’t like other countries especially in regards to fighting on their own soil in the public consciousness. That’ll cut both ways.
At the same time people are people. I’ll refer to historical precedents. .gov’s will not go down without a fight in spite of the evidence to the contrary and the price to be paid.
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